Thursday, February 7, 2008

Political Reality

Although I am still a supporter of Hillary Clinton, and will likely vote for her in the upcoming Texas Democratic primary, I am beginning to see the reasonableness of nominating Barack Obama. This is so because, not surprisingly, Hillary Clinton remains a polarizing figure. The right wing has done such a "good" job of painting her as evil and despicable that many will not vote for her simply because her name is Hillary Clinton.

All of this means that Barack Obama could have a better chance of winning in November. It seems as if John McCain will be the Republican nominee - - of course, that could change, but it is not likely because McCain will win the moderate vote while Romney and Huckabee beat each other up for the more conservative Republican votes. That said, with McCain as a nominee, many evangelicals and hardcore righties may not come out to vote in November. The far-right Republican hate machine fueled by Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter are bashing McCain left and right. Coulter has even said she'd rather vote for Hillary Clinton than John McCain (not sure what she is thinking, but then again, I never am sure about Adam's Apple Annie).

This is especially the case if Obama is the Democratic nominee because, for some reason, he does not engender the hatred that Hillary does. If Hillary is the nominee there are right wingers who would vote for satan, a baby rapist, or Hitler before they'd vote for Hillary, and so they would come out to vote for McCain just to vote against Hillary.

Now, as I said, I am still a Hillary supporter - but that support is soft. I could whole-heartedly endorse Obama and will get behind his candidacy should he be the Democratic nominee. I find his speeches stirring and his policies to be very similar to Clinton's. Who knows, as time goes on, I could even switch allegiances before a Democratic nominee is set?


csm said...

Evidently I posted this blog entry about 10 minutes too soon. It looks like Mitt Romney is dropping out of the race today (Feb 7, 2008).

This does not negate what I posted here (other than the Huckabee and Romney bit), though.

Just about everything in

Al said...

Csm congratulations to your new found sense of reality. The only problem is you reality is nonexistent. Hillary is being ostracized by her party, not righties. Righties have nothing to do with the many Democrat political leaders supporting Obama in the primaries. Hillary is her own worst enemy along with Obama and those who hold the Clintons as the American royal family just can't accept their decline. Her loss actually would be the worst thing that could happen to the Republicans unless she ends up a VP.

csm said...

Keep on nattering Al, but you are not saying anything. Tell me, How is she her own worst enemy?

Furthermore, I am quite sure that there are all manner of reasons why certain Democratic leaders are supporting Obama. He is a compelling candidate with a lot to offer. And the right wing gestapo has tainted Hillary Clinton for many mainstream Americans. I've spoken to quiet a few of them who have no reason to hate Hillary, other than they just do. Many of these same, ostensibly sane individuals will then go on to claim that they KNOW that she has stayed with Bill only for political reasons. How assinine to claim to know. Yet these same people will claim to be "family" values people, while two-facedly thinking Hillary should have divorced Bill rather than keep her family intact (I guess, like other find upstanding divorced Republicans like Ronald Reagan and Rudy Giuliani).

At any rate, it is the lingering stink from the right wing hate machine that will undo Hillary, if indeed, she gets undone. Although she and Obama are nearly even, she still has the delegate lead at this point.

Al said...

Two things I have learned from my many years on this sphere. Never argue with a Raider fan and never attempt to reason with Clinton admirers. Obama's wife stated publically they don't know if they could support Hillary if nominated. I guess the righties got to him too?


The best we can hope for in this election is a McCain victory(though I will NOT vote for him, I have my conscience to deal with)and a Democratic Congress(a done deal)as we might get the sanest federal government we can at this that will do little. The more they get done, the more they FUCK it up. None of these guys/gals have the real long term answers and they never did. LONG LIVE GRIDLOCK WITH THESE TWO PARTIES!!!!

csm said...

A source for that comment from Obama's wife would be useful, Al. Not saying she didn't say it, but I don't trust you, sorry. And you've got things completely backward. Most Clinton haters have little to no reason for their hatred, other than having their blowhard masters (like Rush and Hannity) train them to hate.

And I'm not surprised at your position Bawdy - it is consistent with your past comments on embracing gridlock. I gotta say, too, that McCain is probably these least disagreeable of the motley bunch of Repuglicans that were running this time (except perhaps Ron Paul, who never had a chance). That said, I am still pulling for Hillary or Barack... I really don't wanna be in Iraq for 100 years!

coreydbarbarian said...

okay, i gotta say this, 'cause it might be the only chance i ever get.

al is right.

you should never argue w/ a raiders fan.

fo sho.


re: being there in 100 years

aren't permanent bases in iraq a done deal already? coulda sworn i'd heard that recently...

if they are, there's no way hilary would give it up if it's already established. barack, i don't know.

re: tickets

nothing trumps clinton/obama, but i think an obama/richardson ticket could be equally attractive.

on the other side, a mccain/huckabee ticket looks more & more likely.


You are right corey, we have permanent basing rights in Iraq. The fact we now have a window to the Middle East(right in the middle Of the Middle)I cannot see us giving that up in the near future(maybe in 100 years though)especially considering our security agreements with the Saudis and Kuwatis.

Al said...

Csm, I don't blame you for not trusting me. I sure wouldn't trust you as the die hard Clintonite you are. Never wise but a search would have been quite simple if you really wanted to know.

The sooner the Clintonites realize their party support is the problem, the quicker they can heal. Her own shun her and they should be asking WHY? It's not Rush and the righties.

Personally, I would love a McCain/Obama ticket although I realize that is not possible. My huge concern with Obama is foreign affairs. I doubt seriously Huck will be the VP and I doubt The Clintons and Obama will be a ticket. Obama doesn't need the Clinton's and with McCain you never know.

derF said...

this is for Al!

coreydbarbarian said...

al, your concern for hilary clinton is duly noted, but your spin on the democratic race seems flawed.

re: tickets

please note that i mentioned a clinton/obama ticket, and not vice-versa. if she gets the nod, it serves her to ask him 2 be v.p. and he will, if asked.

however, if obama wins the nomination, he will NOT ask her 2 be his v.p., opening up the possibility of the obama/richardson ticket i mentioned.

on the right, i will admit a mccain/huckabee ticket sounds bizarre. but neither candidate can pull enough support for a (national election) win on his own, allowing a possible maverick/huckster ticket.

i've heard a few other names mentioned as possible running mates for mccain, but none have the pull needed to offset the mavericks negatives in conservatives eyes.

who do you think COULD work? seriously. i'm at a loss.

must be younger. must be pro-life. must be a "without-a-doubt" conservative. maybe a woman??

and this is "the maverick" that we're talking about, so he could pick a democrat for all we know.
just not obama. policy differences and personal history between the 2 gets in the way.

that, and barack is sure 2 be on the democratic ticket somewhere. imo, of course.

coreydbarbarian said...


may i use your michelle obama link as an example of a trend that seems increasingly prevalent?

the press is spinning things WAY out of control. seriously.


***michelle obama says she'd have 2 think about working 2 support hilary 4 president, a standard political "dodge" 2 a question the campaign can't or won't deal with at this time and place.

the media (and al) spin the response as a crisis 4 hilary, lack of support, blah blah. they spin the present 2 look like the future they want most.

*** hilary clinton and most of the media blasted msnbc for saying the clinton campaign "pimped out" chelsea for a campaign event. they equate "pimped out" (as in "wow man, that is one pimped out ride ya got there!") with hilary pimping her daughter on the street for political gain.
and the media marches lockstep with the complaint, because it's good 4 ratings. and the clinton camp spin it 2 their advantage. or, at least, they tried 2. obama still got headlines with 3 wins, as expected.

***bill clinton, after hilary's loss in s. carolina, mentioned that jesse jackson had won s. carolina twice, implying that winning in s. carolina doesn't guarantee a candidate will secure the party's nomination.
the media and clinton haters spin this comment as racist, saying bill actually meant the comment as some sort of slam against s. carolina and blacks.

just wanted 2 vent, 'cause i'm starting 2 get frustrated with the way objectivity gets thrown out the window with our 24/7 news cycle.

Al said...

CB I hardly think I spin anything nor am I overly concerned for Hillary. I have great respect for Hillary and she will find her place but that doesn't mean I must consider her to be the right person for the presidency. Why is it if you feel others are more qualified or stronger leaders it translates into hate for Hillary?

I do agree the press has their favorites and has become biased in all areas of politics? Pro-Obama, anti-Bush the fall of the Clintons and failure in Iraq seem to be their favorite past times.

Thanks for the link derf. An old dog can learn new tricks when properly instructed.

Ceroill said...

derf, thanks from me too. I might actually be able to make links now!

Anonymous said...

Sorry, you'll have to thank coreyd. He's the one who pointed me to the site. I'm just a messenger.


coreydbarbarian said...

al, don't take it personally, ok? it's all good. i understand that you didn't create that particular spin or anything, you just mentioned it.

and y'all don't have 2 thank me 4 anything! i've never committed the html 2 memory, somehow. i bookmarked the page when i found it, and i cut and paste their example. every time. how lazy is that??

coreydbarbarian said...

i'm sure you guys saw's video/song made from an obama speech. ( is one of the black eyed peas, a hip hop/rap group.)
if not, click here.

ahem. yes. we. can.

now there's a mccain parody video!

politics is fun. :)


Thanks corey for the McCain video. The juxtapostion of McCain with people sporting street cred is an eye opener. This is what gets me about ALL the candidates. From my perspective I don't see anyone really honestly telling the electorate what the fuck is really going on(does anyone here hear anything about this country(and the EU) going nose-to-nose with Russia over Kosovo)in this big ol' dangerous world. They keep falling all over each other to give us what they think we want without telling us what we need to start thinking about if this country is to stay afloat. The real dangers in this world are not a rag tag bunch of Muslim zealots who supposedly want to take over the world; it lies in the fact we are blind to the financial, political and geopolitical positions other countries, who share this world with us, hold. These are positions we are mostly responsible for(a perfect example would be a resurgent Russia. If we had helped them when they were down instead of trying to push them into insignificance, our relationship with them could have been markedly different), but most Americans have little time for learning about other cultures and their motivations until they have been slapped in the face(9/11, for example)with that ignorance. None of the candidates are the leader we need; they are just the ones who have the people in their camp who can come up with the cleverest sound bites. Okay, people, back to the electronic narcotic, zzzzzzzzz.